Smiles all round for a good beginning!

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Where: Unknown

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When: 23 October 1944

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A lovely smiley wedding group from Mr. Poole to start the week on a positive note! The happy couple, the witnesses, and the clergy all have broad smiles, while the bride has a firm hold on her man. Ordered by Mr. Richard Siggins of 28 The Glen in Waterford. What can we find out about them?

+++ UPDATE +++
We found out ridiculously fabulous information about them, and much of the heavy lifting was done by Bernard Healy! Meet engine driver Richard Siggins and Emily Cozens, both of 28 The Glen, Waterford. They got married in the Cathedral in Waterford on 23 October 1944, and their witnesses were William Siggins and Mary Josephine Cozens. The presiding priest was Fr. John O'Connor, so just the stray smiling priest yet to be identified...

Photographer: Poole Studio staff

Collection: Poole Photographic Collection, Waterford

Date: 1901-1954 Monday, 23 October 1944

NLI Ref: POOLEWP 4470

You can also view this image, and many thousands of others, on the NLI’s catalogue at catalogue.nli.ie

Info:

Owner: National Library of Ireland on The Commons
Source: Flickr Commons
Views: 4153
arthurhenripoole glassnegative nationallibraryofireland weddingparty smiles richardsiggins 28theglen waterford munster poolephotographiccollection ireland wedding peopleidentified dateestablished emilycozens williamsiggins marycozens maryjosephinecozens frjohnoconnor monday october 1944 1940s 20thcentury ahpoole

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  • profile

    BeachcomberAustralia

    • 22/Feb/2021 09:16:41

    The [email protected] of the woman on the left ... [email protected]! en.wikipedia.org/wiki/At_sign

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    cargeofg

    • 22/Feb/2021 09:22:17

    Heart shaped pockets with sequins must have been in fashion at the time.

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    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 22/Feb/2021 09:27:12

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected] I think the dresses may be the same design but different colours?

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    Bernard Healy

    • 22/Feb/2021 09:29:08

    Okay - Siggins is such an unusual name we should find something... How about this guy - Richard Siggins, retired engine driver, died of a coronary thrombosis at Colville Street, Rosslare Harbour in 1970, aged 71. Married at time of death: civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/death... He's not in the 1901 Census, but is in the 1911 census. www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Wexford/St__Hel... Note other members of family work on the railways. Father is dead; birthplaces of children of household - India, Woolwich, Aldershot suggests military. www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Wexford/St__Hel... Richard himself born in Woolwich. So this wedding - giving the couple's address as 28 The Glen: civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marri... He marries Emily Cozens. Witnesses William Siggins (his big brother, presumably) and Mary Josephine Cozens (NOT her sister - see Census returns below) She is in the 1911 Census here: www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Waterford/Water... And in 1901 she was in Bandon: www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Cork/Bandon/Kil... Making this her birth cert - 1897: civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth... Wedding was at the Cathedral, Waterford; priest was Fr John O'Connor

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    sharon.corbet

    • 22/Feb/2021 09:39:22

    [https://www.flickr.com/photos/bernardhealy] They are there in 1901, they've just been recorded as Seggins instead. Chrome won't let me go near the civil records today, as it claims its certificate has been revoked?

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    cargeofg

    • 22/Feb/2021 09:52:09

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/nlireland Yes. I would agree cuffs shoulder and horizontal pleating below the neckline are all the same.

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    BeachcomberAustralia

    • 22/Feb/2021 09:52:50

    23 October 1944 was a Monday - is that unusual for a wedding?

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    Bernard Healy

    • 22/Feb/2021 10:11:56

    Fr John O'Connor was Administrator of the Cathedral in Waterford at the time of the wedding. Can't tell which one he has, although the 'eye test' suggests that the more serious of the two clergy might be him. Here's a memorial tablet to him: www.igp-web.com/IGPArchives/ire/waterford/photos/tombston... The other priest is probably a friend of the couple. Were he close family, he'd have probably done the wedding. Also, no priests named Siggins or Cozens in Ireland at the time per the Catholic directory. The Father of the groom (William) was indeed in the army - his death cert civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/death... 1901 (aged 41) describes him as Sergeant of the Royal Horse Artillery. Note how on the wedding cert he was described as a "Harness maker". If I had to guess, I'd say that the bridesmaid (Mary Josephine) might be a niece or cousin of the bride. I suppose it's not impossible that her 45-year old mother had another daughter after the 1911 census.

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    Bernard Healy

    • 22/Feb/2021 10:30:29

    Per Google Maps - their home: goo.gl/maps/G5gHR7e1ABGHkZmU6 a mere 7 minute walk to the railway station. I'll add one more thing - the groom doesn't seem to be wearing a wedding ring. As I've mentioned before, the wedding ritual prior to the changes of the 60s & 70s only specified a ring for the bride. Whether the groom wore one seemed to depend on local custom.

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    Niall McAuley

    • 22/Feb/2021 10:35:28

    From his death cert he retired back to Rosslare Harbour where he lived in 1901/1911 as a child. Unusual for both of the couple to give the same address, maybe they were boarders in that house?

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    Niall McAuley

    • 22/Feb/2021 10:46:58

    I think Emily died March 10th 1985

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    Bernard Healy

    • 22/Feb/2021 10:51:47

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauley Possible that he moved back there as part of his work with the railway. In 1911 there seem to be lots of railway workers in the neighbourhood & Colville Street seems to include houses built by the railway company for employees.

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    Bernard Healy

    • 22/Feb/2021 11:25:09

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauley Ah! A bit of googling lets me see where you got that date from. If you're referring to a birthday remembrance, the rest of the advert suggests that there's a family in Rosslare Harbour with a very unusual surname that might remember Mrs Siggins.

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    Niall McAuley

    • 22/Feb/2021 12:19:13

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/ The British Newspaper Archive is behind a pay wall, but shows an anniversary notice for Emily Siggins of Colville Street, Rosslare Harbour, in many years from 1986 on. The OCR is poor, but the notice seems to have been from the Naessens

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    Bernard Healy

    • 22/Feb/2021 12:45:46

    [https://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauley] Yup. I think I stumbled across a birthday remembrance behind another paywall, but it's essentially the same details. BTW, an oddity about Colville Street - the house numbers seem to have four digits. www.daft.ie/for-sale/end-of-terrace-house-no-1167-colvill... The same thing can be found in Railway Terrace, Tralee, so I guess that railway accomodation had an unusual numbering scheme.

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    John Spooner

    • 22/Feb/2021 12:57:33

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauley The anniversary notices give Emily Siggins' address as 1167 Colville St, and there are also anniversary notices for Bridget Naessens of 1177 Colville St, so I'd guess they were neighbours. Why the high house numbers? Nearby Gouldng St and Jameson St also have numbers >1000. They all look as if they are part of the same development.

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    Bernard Healy

    • 22/Feb/2021 13:04:20

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/johnspooner See my comment above - Railway housing. (Sometimes Flickr is not good at showing recently-posted comments.)

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    Niall McAuley

    • 22/Feb/2021 13:06:49

    1167 and 1177 are almost opposite one another.

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    Foxglove

    • 22/Feb/2021 14:34:19

    the smile of the cousin Mary Cozens is very similar to that of the smiling priest, possibly related. The other priest needs to observe Lent and work on buttoning that coat : -)

  • profile

    Bernard Healy

    • 22/Feb/2021 14:47:42

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/foxglove The photo was taken in October... you'd have to have a bit of conditioning put on to survive the winter! ;-)

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    Bernard Healy

    • 22/Feb/2021 15:29:35

    Having a bit of a difficulty tracing the Mary Josephine Cozens who was bridesmaid. She doesn't show up in the civil records as far as I can see. If she was born after 1919, then her birth record wouldn't be online, but I doubt she's a younger sister of the bride because of the age of the bride's mother in the 1911 census. Perhaps she's a niece - but I can find no marriage record for the bride's brother John, so no indication that he started a family. Might she be a cousin? There aren't too many Cozens families in Ireland. The bride's father was born in England and only seems to have converted to Catholicism between the 1901 & 1911 censuses. There's another Cozens family in Dublin, but whether they are related or not, isn't clear. In any event, I can't find any suitable Cozens birth or marriage records that would explain the appearance of Mary Josephine. I'll also add that Mary Josephine strikes me as a very Catholic name, and the Cozens family in Dublin are all Church of Ireland. Now, there are any number of explainations to explain why she's not showing up. There could be a gap in the civil records, or perhaps John Cozens got married and started his family outside Ireland. However, given that this was a wedding in 1944 - during The Emergency - you'd expect the bridemaid to be Irish. Foxglove's comment about the bridesmaid and the priest having the same smile is intruiging. I couldn't find a Fr Cozens in Ireland at the time. However, maybe he was related to the bride's mother whose name was Barden.

  • profile

    Bernard Healy

    • 22/Feb/2021 15:30:17

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/nlireland I'm off the sticky buns for Lent. Can I get one from you at Easter? ;)

  • profile

    Bernard Healy

    • 22/Feb/2021 15:41:03

    OH! This is interesting! The death cert of the bride's mother - civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/death... She died 25th April 1941 at 28 The Glen!!! civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/death... So 28 The Glen was the Cozens family home. Son John of 7 Percy Terrace was present at death. Likewise, the bride's father - civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/death... died 28 The Glen on 9th January 1944. If anyone has access to the appropriate newspapers it'd be interesting to see the death notices or reports of the funerals for the bride's parents. Anyway, one wonders if the groom was lodging at 28 The Glen & if that was how he got to know the bride, or if his address was given as 28 The Glen on the wedding certificate because that was his intended home immediately after the marriage?

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    John Spooner

    • 22/Feb/2021 16:27:05

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/bernardhealy I can't find any death or funeral reports for Waterford Cozens in April 1941 of January 1944 in Waterford papers.

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    sharon.corbet

    • 22/Feb/2021 17:12:36

    [https://www.flickr.com/photos/bernardhealy] Now that Chrome has stopped trying to stymie me, I think Mary Josephine may be John's daughter, but it's all a bit speculative. John was definitely married according to his death cert (note: he's John Joseph). Here's also what appears to be that of his widow, Catherine. Both have an address of 7 Percy Terrace. According to the English marriage record indices, a John J. Cozens married a Catherine Ryan in the Kensington area in 1924. (Unfortunately that's all the info.) The Irish birth record indices also have a Mary Josephine Cozens born in 1927 in Wexford. (Again all the info). Of course, she may still be a more distant relation, but I at least think that that's her in 1927. I do have a tidbit about William Siggins (Richard's brother), assuming that's him there on the right. Apparently, he wanted all his life to emigrate to the US, but he his original plan in the 1920s was stopped by his mother. Finally, in 1951, at the age of 65, he was all set to go, and had even sent his wife and daughter on ahead. However, what he hadn't realised was that according to US immigration law at the time, no matter what passport he held, his birth in India meant that he was considered Indian, which meant he could basically forget emigrating. He decided to go for a long holiday instead. (Yes, this was reported in the newspapers of the day - first the decision to go in 1951, while the outcome even reached the Irish Times in 1952.)

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    Bernard Healy

    • 22/Feb/2021 17:23:21

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/johnspooner Thanks for having a look! https://www.flickr.com/photos/scorbet That looks very plausible. And that story about poor old William Siggins is amazing.

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    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 22/Feb/2021 17:39:07

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/bernardhealy It will be here waiting for you on Easter Monday!!

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    John Spooner

    • 22/Feb/2021 19:08:45

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/scorbet That story reminds me of someone else born in India - Spike Milligan.

    He was born in April 1918 in India, where his father – a member of an Irish family that had emigrated to Britain in the 19th century – was a serving officer in the British Indian Army. Spike’s first school was the Convent of Jesus and Mary in Poona, in the Indian uplands. Leo Alphonsus Milligan enlivened his son Spike’s childhood with hundreds of stories about Ireland, some of them true, others fantastical. Spike himself, however, did not acquire an Irish passport until 1962, after his British passport had been withdrawn when the British Commonwealth Immigrants Act of that year removed his automatic right – and that of millions of others – to British citizenship. When I interviewed him in London for The Irish Times in 1963, just after the publication of Puckoon, he recalled with pleasure and pride the acquisition of his Irish passport. “I rang up the Irish embassy”, he told me, “and asked them if I could become an Irish citizen and they said ‘God, yes.’ I signed one or two forms and it was all over. Got a free drink too. Feel much better know.”
    Irish Times May 21, 2018

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    suckindeesel

    • 22/Feb/2021 20:52:09

    I wonder what happened to Cliff Richard, born in Lucknow, a city in India?

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    Niall McAuley

    • 22/Feb/2021 23:59:08

    Spike could have had a British passport if he applied, but he took offense at having to apply.

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    oursonpolaire

    • 28/Feb/2021 16:16:22

    I'm not sure that the priest needs to work on buttoning up his coat; it appears to be a clerical frock coat, worn by more prosperous clerics in formal but non-cassock situations, and normally only the top button was fastened..