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Where: Munster, Tipperary, Ireland

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When: Unknown

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The Guesthouse, Mount Saint Joseph's, Roscrea is todays image. When I was scanning our list to see what should be posted I saw the catalogue number beginning with "L_IMP" denoting an Imperial sized glass plate I just had to post it. We have had very few Emperor sized plate to post here and I look forward to scanning the detail in this fine shot. I think that I can see one or two of those in the house looking out at Robert as he takes his shot?

Photographer: Robert French

Collection: Lawrence Photograph Collection

Date: Circa 1865 - 1914

NLI Ref: L_IMP_4240

You can also view this image, and many thousands of others, on the NLI’s catalogue at catalogue.nli.ie

Info:

Owner: National Library of Ireland on The Commons
Source: Flickr Commons
Views: 3160
robertfrench williamlawrence lawrencecollection lawrencephotographicstudio thelawrencephotographcollection glassnegative nationallibraryofireland mountstjosephs roscrea cooffaly leinster guesthouse imperialplate trappist cistercians abbey

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  • profile

    Rory_Sherlock

    • 28/Apr/2022 07:55:03

    Flickr is sometimes amazing... Shay Connolly has this photo from 2013 195

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    Rory_Sherlock

    • 28/Apr/2022 07:56:42

    The battlements seem to have been replaced by an extra floor level

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    ɹǝqɯoɔɥɔɐǝq

    • 28/Apr/2022 08:41:26

    I think today's photo is a fair while before this Keogh Bros one from 1911 (with a motor car). Particularly the creeper on the right - From - www.historicalpicturearchive.com/shop/pictures/tp-00047/

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    ɹǝqɯoɔɥɔɐǝq

    • 28/Apr/2022 08:46:01

    The railings and lamps (and presumably stairs) are there in the 1911 photo, but not there on the 25" map. Forgotten how to find the map date, but someone will know ...

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    ɹǝqɯoɔɥɔɐǝq

    • 28/Apr/2022 08:56:53

    Aha! Mr French / Lawrence revisited the Guest House later, when the railings and creeper on the right were there - catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000042469

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    ɹǝqɯoɔɥɔɐǝq

    • 28/Apr/2022 09:11:46

    And there is a reverse view (same day?) which might provide more date clues - catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000327943 Edit - and a long view - catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000327944 💡Edit 2 - In this later long view there is a massive new building to the left of the church. What and when? - catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000323024

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    John Spooner

    • 28/Apr/2022 09:37:20

    In an article entitled "Here and There Through Ireland", the reporter J. O'B. describes a journey which includes a trip to Roscrea as a guest at the Monastery, published in the Derry Journal on Wednesday 08 March 1911

    Beside Roscrea is the famous Monastery of Mount Saint Joseph, occupied by the Trappists. The monastery and beautiful college stands in the midst of a noble park, closely wooded. The Trappists Order is one of the most severe in the Catholic Church. Silence is one of their strictest rules, and priests and brothers have each day manual labour. They have the farm a corn mill, threshing mill, and every requisite within themselves. The Fathers are most hospitable, and guests are welcome to stay as long as they wish. Every comfort is provided, and if a visitor does not wish to make a voluntary contribution, no one asks them for any. No quieter or more suitable place for making a retreat could found. In Brother Theobald and Brother Eugene guest masters you have two gentlemen who at once make you at home. People in the world imagine members of religious Orders so strict are gloomy and sad, but to get into conversation with any the monks in Mount Saint Joseph you soon find your mistake. There are few topics of conversation but in which they can take a natural and cheery part, and you would asking yourself, How do these gentlemen know so much” ? It is a delightful spot, and you have a feeling of regret when you mount a car that takes you the station.
    I wondered if the monk in the foreground might be Brother Theobald or Brother Eugene, but if the date is substantially before 1911 it is more likely to be a successor.

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    ɹǝqɯoɔɥɔɐǝq

    • 28/Apr/2022 10:02:42

    The "massive new building" I referred to above is the College, planned 1902 and opened 1905. See the relevant history - msjroscrea.ie/history/early-history-of-the-monastery/ I think today's photo (and the other Imperial plates) are definitely after 1884 when the church was consecrated - see catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000326424 , and 1902 when the College was planned. Around 1890 ?

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    Niall McAuley

    • 28/Apr/2022 12:10:08

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/beachcomberaustralia The 25" was surveyed in 1909.

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    Niall McAuley

    • 28/Apr/2022 12:15:08

    Per the DIA, the attic story replaced the castellations in the 1960s.

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    Niall McAuley

    • 28/Apr/2022 12:17:46

    The NIAH does not know of any work between 1884 and the new college in 1902-05

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    suckindeesel

    • 28/Apr/2022 12:19:47

    [https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/] The 25” survey is 1909 arcg.is/1qyb181

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    Niall McAuley

    • 28/Apr/2022 12:29:07

    Paging back in the Imp catalogue, I see Lough Conn Hotel, which existed (at most) from 1891 to 1912: www.ouririshheritage.org/content/archive/place/miscellane...

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    Niall McAuley

    • 28/Apr/2022 12:39:01

    Paging forward, a general view of Rosscarbery includes an 1899 house. www.buildingsofireland.ie/buildings-search/building/20855...

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    ɹǝqɯoɔɥɔɐǝq

    • 28/Apr/2022 14:11:06

    [https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]] [https://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauley] Oops, sorry - I see from the 25" map I was wrong about that building on the left of the church being the 1905 College. It must be part of the Abbey, built after today's photo. Someone with local knowledge will know. To clarify - a long view taken on the same day as today's photo (by the position of the sash windows) - catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000327944 - does not have the huge building to the left (not the College), seen in later photos - catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000323024 The College looks like this - catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000323027 Clear as mud. Must go to bed ...

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    Niall McAuley

    • 28/Apr/2022 15:06:10

    [https://www.flickr.com/photos/beachcomberaustralia] The church in the long view catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000323024 is from 1880, and today has a spire from 1935. The big buildings are the abbey, from c. 1905

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    silverio10

    • 28/Apr/2022 20:05:07

    Buenas fotos antiguas .

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    ɹǝqɯoɔɥɔɐǝq

    • 28/Apr/2022 21:27:58

    [https://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauley] Thank you. The NIAH is, as usual, not quite accurate enough! The Abbey's own history page has - "... Mount Saint Joseph was constituted an Abbey at the end of 1886, and in August 1887 Dom Camillus Beardwood, bursar of Mount Mellaray and brother of the Mount Saint Joseph architect, was elected Abbot. Under the guidance of the two Beardwoods, Abbot and Architect, the monastery buildings were completed and the fine farmyard begun. ..." See - msjroscrea.ie/history/early-history-of-the-monastery/ Ping @ www.flickr.com/photos/bernardhealy/ who will know ... Aside - The difference in image quality between Imperial and Royal plates, taken inside the church seconds apart, likely the same day as today's photo ... catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000326424 - L_IMP_4241 catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000323026 - L_ROY_03916 Spot the differences.

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    Aidrean S

    • 29/Apr/2022 09:50:37

    The original mansion built by the Heaton family has served as the guesthouse for Mount St Joseph Abbey since the early days of the monastery. Mount Saint Joseph Abbey is a monastery of the Order of Cistercians of Strict Observance (OCSO), and was founded in 1878. The following sections discuss the history and development of monasticism, bringing us through the years to the time of the foundation of this monastery. The origins of monasticism can be traced back to before the Christian era. In the sixth century St Benedict drew up his Rule for Monks, and it is this Rule that is followed by the community of monks at Mount Saint Joseph. Today the Cistercian way of life is followed worldwide by 200 monasteries with c.4,000 members. The Guesthouse is open for resident guests all year round and offers comfortable accommodation and welcomes people from many varied backgrounds. Some may just want a quiet time to reflect and rest, away from the stress of everyday life, while others may be seeking solace in distress or trying to discern the Lord’s will for them or talk things through with one of the community. The community’s prayer will support them and call down God’s gift of peace on them. Found at the Mount St. Joseph's Abbey Website

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    Dr. Ilia

    • 04/May/2022 08:00:09

    Nice!