Route 2 Car 263
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Where: Leinster, Dublin City, Ireland
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When: Unknown
Try to find the date or year when this image was made.
For the next few days we have a feast of Dublin Tram related shots which we hope will not get you all too excited. Today, compliments of the Dublin Tram Collection we find ourselves in Sandymount Co. Dublin. With this lovely photo of Car, no 263 plying its trade on route 2. The Motor Car in the distance should help us narrow the date range substantially. Over to you.
Photographers: Chiefly, William Arthur Camwell
Collection: Dublin Trams Collection
Date:ca.1884-1963 1928-1940
NLI Ref: NPA TRAM41
You can also view this image, and many thousands of others, on the NLI’s catalogue at catalogue.nli.ie
Source: Flickr Commons
Views: 2773
Photographers: Chiefly, William Arthur Camwell
Collection: Dublin Trams Collection
Date:
NLI Ref: NPA TRAM41
You can also view this image, and many thousands of others, on the NLI’s catalogue at catalogue.nli.ie
Info:
Owner: National Library of Ireland on The CommonsSource: Flickr Commons
Views: 2773
dublintramscollection
nationallibraryofireland
dublin
leinster
ireland
bw
sandymountgreen
sandymount
codublin
car263
route2
tram
motorcar
batt
hafnerssausages
conductor
josephryan
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Niall McAuley
Per Wikipedia the trams to Sandymount were electrified in March 1901, earliest date. The trams stopped operating in 1940.
Niall McAuley
Those look like horse chestnut trees in flower in the background, so springtime.
Niall McAuley
In streetview, we can see that Batts and Murphys have been replaced by an ugly AIB. It looks more modern than the latest possible date here (trams). Edit: looking again, I think the bank just replaced Batt's. The distinctive 1st floor window of Murphy's is still there.
National Library of Ireland on The Commons
https://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauley Up and at it early today Niall, Thanks, Mary
Niall McAuley
Ryans Sandymount House pub was Ryans in this shot, but Fleming in the 1905ish French images. A google search suggests Fleming opened in 1893. He was here for the 1911 census. We were here before with O'Connor (pub is still Fleming):
Niall McAuley
This local history page suggests: In 1925 Joseph Ryan bought the pub
Niall McAuley
So todays shot is probably 1925 (Ryans) to 1940 (last tram).
National Library of Ireland on The Commons
https://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauley Is that a Sweet Afton advert outside the front of the pub? It could help with the date range.
Niall McAuley
Batt has a sign out saying Established 18xx, but I can't read it.
Niall McAuley
Tram route numbers replaced the earlier route symbols in 1918.
suckindeesel
https://www.flickr.com/photos/47290943@N03/ Sweet Afton introduced 1919 “Flow gently, sweet Afton, amang thy green braes Flow gently, I’ll sing thee a song in thy praise My Mary’s asleep by they murmuring stream Flow gently, sweet Afton, disturb not her dream” As smoked by Thomas Shelby
Niall McAuley
Having eyeballed rear views of a lot of vintage cars, I can't identify this one, but it definitely looks after 1930 to me.
National Library of Ireland on The Commons
http://www.flickr.com/photos/30369211@N00/ Excellent, thank you. So 1925-1940 is our much better date range.
O Mac
The similar DUTC "bogie standard" 74 seater tram no.253 now in the Howth Transport Museum was built in 1928
ɹǝqɯoɔɥɔɐǝq
Everyone seems to be staring at the camera. Particularly admiring the skill of the delivery boy balancing his bike.
National Library of Ireland on The Commons
https://www.flickr.com/photos/91549360@N03 date range updated to earliest 1928,
Niall McAuley
[https://www.flickr.com/photos/91549360@N03] A pic of similar tram 253 at wikipedia
Niall McAuley
Thomas Batt the chemist died in 1918, but that is not to say the shop changed names. Son George Batt is listed as a pharmaceutical chemist on his wedding record in 1904. Also listed as MPSI on daughter Jessie's wedding record in 1931, still living at 98 Sandymount Road as in the 1911 census.
suckindeesel
Standard saloon 263 built 1926, withdrawn 1940
Niall McAuley
On the sign saying SQUIRE, just left of Ryans - is the building next door (now Books on the Green) getting renovated, and SQUIRE is the builder? dia and NIAH no help today.
Niall McAuley
I see a George Squire, general contractor, referenced in the DIA, 1912 to 1933. 38 in 1911, Mr. Squire lived to be 80.
suckindeesel
Hafners ‘model sausage factory’ of (South Great) Georges St., I remember it well. There was, of course, the less well known North Great Georges St. Hafners are still going strong.
Niall McAuley
Ad on the side of the tram is for Black & White Scotch, which seems to have become a brand in the 1890s. Not a Whisky drinker, but I do like the logo:
Niall McAuley
There is a bilingual street name sign for Sandymount Road on Batts, it would have been green. I wonder when that style started? Hmm, I just see "early 20th century". Having them be bilingual was apparently a bit rebellious.
suckindeesel
The conductor’s uniform, particularly the tensioned crown type cap, was introduced in the early 1930s. www.tramwaybadgesandbuttons.com/page148/page149/page324/p...
suckindeesel
[https://www.flickr.com/photos/30369211@N00/] No clear answer to the bilingual signs date, Blackrock Township had bilingual black and white signs as early as 1901. Then there was the change from the old Gaelic script and a colour change from green to blue. dublininquirer.com/2020/06/10/documenting-the-history-of-...
suckindeesel
https://www.flickr.com/photos/32162360@N00/ The ‘basket boy’ was a feature of those earlier times, usually delivering groceries or collecting empty beer bottles for return to the local pub, many pubs filled their own bottles. And people think that recycling is a much modern invention. Our primary school teacher would predict that we would end up as basket boys if we didn’t attend to our studies
National Library of Ireland on The Commons
http://www.flickr.com/photos/184711311@N04/ Ah, nothing like support and encouragement from a teacher to buoy you up! Did you prove them wrong? 😀
suckindeesel
https://www.flickr.com/photos/47290943@N03/ Yes, in my case, some of the others not so much. Expectations were low and you were supposed to know your ‘station in life’. It was a different world and a different time then.
oaktree_brian_1976
Route 2 ran from 1901 to 1940, buses started replacing routes in 1925. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dublin_tramways#Dublin_United_Tramw...
oaktree_brian_1976
Rather disappointed that I can't find a roster of the trams. Best I can do is that the enclosed trams like the one shown here came along in the mid 1920's. www.nationaltransportmuseum.org/b005.html
oaktree_brian_1976
If you have a photo of the tram #253 I can give you a full history!
National Library of Ireland on The Commons
https://www.flickr.com/photos/66151649@N02 Thanks Brian, I do not think we have a photo of Car 253. Mary
Frank Fullard
When I was a young fells I remember that lots of people from the country visiting Dublin would come home with Haffners sausages. Lovely they were too!
National Library of Ireland on The Commons
Frank Fullard Are they still on the go, Frank? There are a few older Dublin sausage makes that are... I think Granby's are still around. Not sure about the others mentioned here.
Frank Fullard
https://www.flickr.com/photos/nlireland The brand is still there! They are still sold as Hafner's Sausages and are now manufactured by Mallons in Monaghan, and I believe you can get them in SuperValue.
National Library of Ireland on The Commons
https://www.flickr.com/photos/frankfullard Will keep a weather eye out for them, thanks!
ɹǝqɯoɔɥɔɐǝq
The "What's for dinner?" Tram Limerick There once was a geyser called Gossage, Who slaved counting profit and lossage. On his homeward tram He'd look forward to ham, Some bacon, or possibly sausage.